Sigh, another mass shooting....

Come discus news articles of the day with a bit of an NPR focus.

Moderators: AA Admin, AA Mod

User avatar
Z is for Zangie
Posts: 10403
Joined: Mon Aug 26, 2019 3:47 pm
Location: OH
Has thanked: 4301 times
Been thanked: 1514 times

Sigh, another mass shooting....

Post by Z is for Zangie » Wed May 25, 2022 1:35 pm

annetelenas.jpg



User avatar
Z is for Zangie
Posts: 10403
Joined: Mon Aug 26, 2019 3:47 pm
Location: OH
Has thanked: 4301 times
Been thanked: 1514 times

Re: Sigh, another mass shooting....

Post by Z is for Zangie » Wed May 25, 2022 2:01 pm

At least there was some good news out of Georgia, Trump may be losing his grip...
One of the posters on The Dispatch said he lives in MTG's district and he didn't vote for her, and no one he knew did and they all lobbied to get rid of her. He says he doesn't know where these people that did vote for her are, but, they sure aren't where he is.

Mike
Posts: 3795
Joined: Fri Aug 30, 2019 3:03 pm
Has thanked: 49 times
Been thanked: 639 times

Re: Sigh, another mass shooting....

Post by Mike » Wed May 25, 2022 2:27 pm

Z is for Zangie wrote:
Wed May 25, 2022 2:01 pm
At least there was some good news out of Georgia, Trump may be losing his grip...
One of the posters on The Dispatch said he lives in MTG's district and he didn't vote for her, and no one he knew did and they all lobbied to get rid of her. He says he doesn't know where these people that did vote for her are, but, they sure aren't where he is.
The only bad news associated with that: it might have become that even trump and MTG are no longer extreme enough for where the average GOP voter is nowadays. I know a number of them who are now into this D’Souza film that alleges major corruption at the voting drop boxes. Even OAN won’t touch this crapola, yet average Repubs on the street are all over it and shrieking that the vote was stolen in 2020

As for the shooting, my goodness. Kid turns 18, buys himself a couple AR15s and goes and slaughters an entire classroom. I’m sorry gun rights folks, but this does not occur if guns are not so readily available. That your average Republican not only supports this availability, but is fighting to keep guns as untraceable as possible, well… this is your result.

User avatar
GuideToACrazyWorld
Posts: 8390
Joined: Tue Aug 20, 2019 1:31 pm
Location: California
Has thanked: 792 times
Been thanked: 2316 times

Re: Sigh, another mass shooting....

Post by GuideToACrazyWorld » Wed May 25, 2022 4:34 pm

I will not talk about gun control under the context of a single tragedy. I will say regardless of what we do with gun control, we have to do a better job of recognizing what leads children to this point and finding ways to help them before it happens. It doesn't matter if they have access to guns or not, they are a danger to all of us.

User avatar
Slip Shod
Posts: 1547
Joined: Sun Aug 15, 2021 2:30 am
Location: Tennessee
Has thanked: 1019 times
Been thanked: 774 times

Re: Sigh, another mass shooting....

Post by Slip Shod » Wed May 25, 2022 4:49 pm

GuideToACrazyWorld wrote:
Wed May 25, 2022 4:34 pm
I will not talk about gun control under the context of a single tragedy. I will say regardless of what we do with gun control, we have to do a better job of recognizing what leads children to this point and finding ways to help them before it happens. It doesn't matter if they have access to guns or not, they are a danger to all of us.
He killed his grandmother earlier in the day - there was a 30-year-old white guy yesterday in Tennessee tried to get into a elementary school with kindergarten kids. young teacher took him on by herself, she was half his size until she had help from a couple other teachers. They held him down till the police came 'a half hour later', suffered a broken arm in the encounter. Point being the cops didn't get there for 30 minutes. This guy was unarmed but .. 30 minutes. If she would have been armed she could have disposed of him quickly.

Senor Natural
Posts: 2647
Joined: Thu Aug 29, 2019 1:58 am
Has thanked: 270 times
Been thanked: 279 times

Re: Sigh, another mass shooting....

Post by Senor Natural » Wed May 25, 2022 5:05 pm

Slip Shod wrote:
Wed May 25, 2022 4:49 pm
GuideToACrazyWorld wrote:
Wed May 25, 2022 4:34 pm
I will not talk about gun control under the context of a single tragedy. I will say regardless of what we do with gun control, we have to do a better job of recognizing what leads children to this point and finding ways to help them before it happens. It doesn't matter if they have access to guns or not, they are a danger to all of us.
He killed his grandmother earlier in the day - there was a 30-year-old white guy yesterday in Tennessee tried to get into a elementary school with kindergarten kids. young teacher took him on by herself, she was half his size until she had help from a couple other teachers. They held him down till the police came 'a half hour later', suffered a broken arm in the encounter. Point being the cops didn't get there for 30 minutes. This guy was unarmed but .. 30 minutes. If she would have been armed she could have disposed of him quickly.
Do you carry a firearm? Daily? In public?

User avatar
Slip Shod
Posts: 1547
Joined: Sun Aug 15, 2021 2:30 am
Location: Tennessee
Has thanked: 1019 times
Been thanked: 774 times

Re: Sigh, another mass shooting....

Post by Slip Shod » Wed May 25, 2022 5:26 pm

@ señor. In Tennessee the carjackers, the armed robberies and home invasions, drug dealers - they are armed daily, but they can never be sure who's legally caring. There's been instances of a robbery going down in a convenience store or dollar store and the bad guy gets blown away by a customer carrying so they just never know. I don't carry every day but it's important that we have the right to do so. It's a little bit more of a deterrent because the bad guy never knows if this is his last day.
In Tennessee the bottom line is if you feared for your life or defending another of great bodily harm or life

Mike
Posts: 3795
Joined: Fri Aug 30, 2019 3:03 pm
Has thanked: 49 times
Been thanked: 639 times

Re: Sigh, another mass shooting....

Post by Mike » Wed May 25, 2022 7:21 pm

GuideToACrazyWorld wrote:
Wed May 25, 2022 4:34 pm
I will not talk about gun control under the context of a single tragedy. I will say regardless of what we do with gun control, we have to do a better job of recognizing what leads children to this point and finding ways to help them before it happens. It doesn't matter if they have access to guns or not, they are a danger to all of us.
The children are a danger to all of us?

I’m not talking in the context of a single tragedy. The context is this one huge tragedy, set among 212 similar if smaller tragedies since the beginning of this year. Set among year after year, decade after decade, of similar numbers of tragedies.

I recognize the 2nd Amendment. Yet it cannot be unlimited, can it? And if we are to speak of principles, both explicit and underlying, are not principles given their value by the results they generate? By their fruit ye shall know them….. if a sacrosanct ‘principle’ continues to yield horrendous results, perhaps that principle needs to be re-thought.

User avatar
GuideToACrazyWorld
Posts: 8390
Joined: Tue Aug 20, 2019 1:31 pm
Location: California
Has thanked: 792 times
Been thanked: 2316 times

Re: Sigh, another mass shooting....

Post by GuideToACrazyWorld » Wed May 25, 2022 8:56 pm

Mike wrote:
Wed May 25, 2022 7:21 pm
The children are a danger to all of us?
No, these children. Ones who are so broken they would pick up a gun and gun down a school full of people. I don't pretend to understand, but I do think as a society we need to do better. While guns make them more dangerous, they are dangerous with or without them. And I do think the more important action is to figure out a way to identify and help these people before they get to that point. It's also the hardest thing to resolve.
Mike wrote:
Wed May 25, 2022 7:21 pm
I recognize the 2nd Amendment. Yet it cannot be unlimited, can it?
No, it can't. I'm not a 2nd amendment absolutist at all. For instance most people will agree we shouldn't give nukes to anyone who can afford one. That alone should be enough for people to not be absolutists about the 2nd, of course it isn't. Part of the problem is that the entire conversation is always so emotional. I'm completely comfortable with gun control conversations that focus on what capabilities a weapon should have. I'm not going to play the "Any one who disagree want's children to die" game or the, "You are trying to take away our guns to control us!" I don't fine either very interesting or very useful. Nor do I find meaninglessly scary sounding terms like "assault weapon" are all that useful. Again it's all a bunch of appeals to emotion.

To avoid misunderstand this isn't why I won't talk about gun control around the context of a tragedy. I knew someone who was killed in the Las Vegas shooting. We weren't close, but I did know her. It really put a different perspective on these events. I find it disgusting that people would try to use someone else's tragedy to push their political agenda. I'm not accusing you of doing any of this. I'm just explaining my perspective as best I can.
Mike wrote:
Wed May 25, 2022 7:21 pm
if a sacrosanct ‘principle’ continues to yield horrendous results, perhaps that principle needs to be re-thought.
I think you are over simplifying a very complex issue. The problem with this level of hyperbole is it creates easy straw man. Things like, "A gun, by itself, can't kill anyone", "Guns don't make people violent." I'm pretty sure you know better then any of that, but when you act like those children are dead because people hold the 2nd sacrosanct, those kinds of silly ideas do logically follow the argument. What guns do is make it easier to kill. What weapons make it too easy is a valuable conversation, but we can't have those conversion when it's getting drown out by appeals to emotion and other rhetoric.

Mike
Posts: 3795
Joined: Fri Aug 30, 2019 3:03 pm
Has thanked: 49 times
Been thanked: 639 times

Re: Sigh, another mass shooting....

Post by Mike » Wed May 25, 2022 10:45 pm

“Perhaps that principle needs to be re-thought” is oversimplifying? Hyperbole? Straw man?

This is where you lose me man.

User avatar
GuideToACrazyWorld
Posts: 8390
Joined: Tue Aug 20, 2019 1:31 pm
Location: California
Has thanked: 792 times
Been thanked: 2316 times

Re: Sigh, another mass shooting....

Post by GuideToACrazyWorld » Wed May 25, 2022 10:48 pm

Mike wrote:
Wed May 25, 2022 10:45 pm
“Perhaps that principle needs to be re-thought” is oversimplifying? Hyperbole? Straw man?
No, that isn't what I said. So clearly I have lost you.

What I was calling hyperbole, is this idea that guns cause these incidents or more correctly the idea that the legalization of guns makes this happen. That ignores everything else that goes into it. There is a clear difference between guns making these incidents more deadly, and guns being the root cause of the incident.

I never said you were committing a straw man, what I said was it creates easy strawman arguments for the other sided and even gave you a couple of examples.

Senor Natural
Posts: 2647
Joined: Thu Aug 29, 2019 1:58 am
Has thanked: 270 times
Been thanked: 279 times

Re: Sigh, another mass shooting....

Post by Senor Natural » Thu May 26, 2022 12:02 am

Slip Shod wrote:
Wed May 25, 2022 5:26 pm
@ señor. In Tennessee the carjackers, the armed robberies and home invasions, drug dealers - they are armed daily, but they can never be sure who's legally caring. There's been instances of a robbery going down in a convenience store or dollar store and the bad guy gets blown away by a customer carrying so they just never know. I don't carry every day but it's important that we have the right to do so. It's a little bit more of a deterrent because the bad guy never knows if this is his last day.
In Tennessee the bottom line is if you feared for your life or defending another of great bodily harm or life
So, you are fearful, and because of the ease of getting guns, your criminals have them, and you justify carrying them for that reason.
All those guns have made Tennessee a dangerous place, a place where you fear enough that you carry a gun.
To be frank with you, I never knew Tennessee was such a criminal sh*thole, nor that is was full of fearful people.

User avatar
Slip Shod
Posts: 1547
Joined: Sun Aug 15, 2021 2:30 am
Location: Tennessee
Has thanked: 1019 times
Been thanked: 774 times

Re: Sigh, another mass shooting....

Post by Slip Shod » Thu May 26, 2022 12:34 am

Senor Natural wrote:
Thu May 26, 2022 12:02 am
To be frank with you, I never knew Tennessee was such a criminal sh*thole, nor that is was full of fearful people.
[/quote]
Slip to señor.. hello, Slip to señor
As always, appreciate your view of things.
~
h7NAlednEK6XNtXPaf.gif
h7NAlednEK6XNtXPaf.gif (84.9 KiB) Viewed 1851 times

Mike
Posts: 3795
Joined: Fri Aug 30, 2019 3:03 pm
Has thanked: 49 times
Been thanked: 639 times

Re: Sigh, another mass shooting....

Post by Mike » Thu May 26, 2022 2:58 am

On various news shows this evening, I watched more than two dozen Republican senators - and two Dems - smile and say nothing as reporters attempted to elicit words from them concerning this slaughtered classroom. Anyone can guess the two Dems….. but it’s not like these folks tried to cower as they evaded the reporters. No, they SMILED.

I don’t get it. How can you, as a United States Senator, smile when asked about this event? Evading the question is one thing, but SMILING?? Go find the vids. The Dems ought finally give up on bipartisanship, since it’s not working anyway, and just eject Joe Mansion and Kristen SINema from the party. They hold virtually none of the party’s core principles, and do none of the party’s agenda. And they SMILE when asked about the gunning down of an entire classroom full of children.

And from trumpist Qanon Arizona Rep. Paul Gosar today, the shooter was a transsexual. A “transsexual leftist illegal alien”, to be exact. Soon as the shooter’s name was released on Tuesday, I knew the right would start with the ‘alien’ angle. As it happens, he was born in Uvalde. So he is not an immigrant. Which of course makes the alien thing a typically racist Republican screed. And by the definitions of the overwhelming majority of conservatives, a guy still in his teens is too young to know if his sexual identity is out of alignment with his physical feature set. So for the Right to so quickly reach for transsexual, well, they are clearly doing nothing more than displaying their bias s they attempt to distract and deflect.

What the shooter was, to no one’s surprise, was bullied.

Mike
Posts: 3795
Joined: Fri Aug 30, 2019 3:03 pm
Has thanked: 49 times
Been thanked: 639 times

Re: Sigh, another mass shooting....

Post by Mike » Thu May 26, 2022 3:44 pm

And it gets even more ugly:
5A524085-1E15-4876-BC8E-383C41431E34.jpeg
And of course, guns are not allowed at this convention. Why?

I can hear trump now: yeah, there was a shooting. A tragedy, a terrible terrible tragedy. I hear the shooter was an illegal alien, and a transsexual! It’s people like him that these ultra-liberal democrats want to replace you in this nation. Well you know what I’ve been saying about those Mexicans, I wanted to bomb that nation. Anyway, while the occasional shooting happens you still have your freedom. Don’t let this impact my 2024 run for president!

Senor Natural
Posts: 2647
Joined: Thu Aug 29, 2019 1:58 am
Has thanked: 270 times
Been thanked: 279 times

Re: Sigh, another mass shooting....

Post by Senor Natural » Thu May 26, 2022 5:10 pm

Slip Shod wrote:
Thu May 26, 2022 12:34 am
Senor Natural wrote:
Thu May 26, 2022 12:02 am
To be frank with you, I never knew Tennessee was such a criminal sh*thole, nor that is was full of fearful people.
Slip to señor.. hello, Slip to señor
As always, appreciate your view of things.
~
h7NAlednEK6XNtXPaf.gif
[/quote]
I'd have to remove your head from inside it first . . .

Mike
Posts: 3795
Joined: Fri Aug 30, 2019 3:03 pm
Has thanked: 49 times
Been thanked: 639 times

Re: Sigh, another mass shooting....

Post by Mike » Thu May 26, 2022 7:44 pm

Yesterday, Gov.Abbott claimed that the shooter was ‘engaged’ after wrecking his vehicle but before entering the building: “officers with the consolidated school district… they approached the gunman and engaged with the gunman at that time. The gunman then entered a back door and went down….”

Ted Cruz has stated that the solution to this is armed guards at schools. I’m very confused here. How did these officers ‘engage’ the gunman, yet the gunman manages to get into the building. And the get in a classroom , and barricade himself in there… and shoot 21 people to death? And now today, the Abbott story has changed. A-patently now, h entered the building unobstructed. Did or didn’t officers engage the shooter prior to entry? Did the building have security personnel? Where were they? Were they armed? What actually occurred here?

Btw, video footage shows him carrying a long rifle. Presumably one of his newly purchased AR15s.

Mike
Posts: 3795
Joined: Fri Aug 30, 2019 3:03 pm
Has thanked: 49 times
Been thanked: 639 times

Re: Sigh, another mass shooting....

Post by Mike » Thu May 26, 2022 8:21 pm

The story just changed again: apparently, the shooter was outside the school shooting for 12 minutes before walking in!

How did this occur, AND THEN he walks in and slaughters a full classroom over 45 minutes or more? In a state supposedly full of good guys with guns, who are the antidote to bad guys with guns?

Senor Natural
Posts: 2647
Joined: Thu Aug 29, 2019 1:58 am
Has thanked: 270 times
Been thanked: 279 times

Re: Sigh, another mass shooting....

Post by Senor Natural » Fri May 27, 2022 2:49 am

Official cover up and lies.
Uvalde cops and Texas DPS were so scared they didn't go in for 40 minutes, spent the time handcuffing and preventing parents from trying to save their children.
Bunch fat local cowards, and a bunch of authoritarian Texas DPS cowboy hat wearing explainers . . . no one is buying the BS anymore.

Mike
Posts: 3795
Joined: Fri Aug 30, 2019 3:03 pm
Has thanked: 49 times
Been thanked: 639 times

Re: Sigh, another mass shooting....

Post by Mike » Fri May 27, 2022 11:40 am

Last night, the Kimmel monologue - which was apparently about Uvalde - was cut short in Dallas. They went to commercial.

The station, WFAA, is claiming a technical glitch.

User avatar
Z is for Zangie
Posts: 10403
Joined: Mon Aug 26, 2019 3:47 pm
Location: OH
Has thanked: 4301 times
Been thanked: 1514 times

Re: Sigh, another mass shooting....

Post by Z is for Zangie » Fri May 27, 2022 12:57 pm

Well, lots of students all over the country are walking out to protest...I am cynical unfortunately, that it will work, anymore than other times, but, one can hope.

Mike
Posts: 3795
Joined: Fri Aug 30, 2019 3:03 pm
Has thanked: 49 times
Been thanked: 639 times

Re: Sigh, another mass shooting....

Post by Mike » Fri May 27, 2022 9:25 pm

Two other things died that day: the myth of Texas, and the myth of the “good guy with a gun”.

Mike
Posts: 3795
Joined: Fri Aug 30, 2019 3:03 pm
Has thanked: 49 times
Been thanked: 639 times

Re: Sigh, another mass shooting....

Post by Mike » Sun May 29, 2022 12:19 am

‘You don’t trust us to convey history or science or mathematics, or to choose library books. Now you’re gonna arm us, and expect us to always be ready when a lunatic with an AR15 bursts into the building? - a wise teacher

Mike
Posts: 3795
Joined: Fri Aug 30, 2019 3:03 pm
Has thanked: 49 times
Been thanked: 639 times

Re: Sigh, another mass shooting....

Post by Mike » Sun May 29, 2022 2:45 am

And here we go. Just like so very many previous mass school shootings (sucks that I’m saying that), the Right is claiming it’s either a hoax or a false flag. Yep, Marjorie Greene made the false flag claim today.

User avatar
Z is for Zangie
Posts: 10403
Joined: Mon Aug 26, 2019 3:47 pm
Location: OH
Has thanked: 4301 times
Been thanked: 1514 times

Re: Sigh, another mass shooting....

Post by Z is for Zangie » Sun May 29, 2022 2:52 am

Mike wrote:
Sun May 29, 2022 2:45 am
And here we go. Just like so very many previous mass school shootings (sucks that I’m saying that), the Right is claiming it’s either a hoax or a false flag. Yep, Marjorie Greene made the false flag claim today.
It is probably a hopeless wish, but going by Madison Cawthorn, this may be something that finally gets noticed by McCarthy...and at the least, it may cost her politically...there are a lot of conservative women out there ( mostly suburbanites) who are not really happy now about what has happened and the obfuscating from the right about fixing it or at least trying to.

Post Reply